Just bought the pdf so I've some questions

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Bosper
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Re: Just bought the pdf so I've some questions

Postby Bosper » Fri Aug 26, 2016 4:15 pm

Ceremonies count as Chants just as Rituals count as spells. You start with none but can choose them at creation. just as spells/rituals/chants you have to activate and pay them

Warden
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Re: Just bought the pdf so I've some questions

Postby Warden » Fri Aug 26, 2016 4:37 pm

So any reason why Blessed Ones of Rondra page 75 and Peraine page 77 starts with no Ceremonies?

Flash
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Re: Just bought the pdf so I've some questions

Postby Flash » Fri Aug 26, 2016 5:17 pm

Bosper wrote:Ceremonies count as Chants just as Rituals count as spells. You start with none but can choose them at creation. just as spells/rituals/chants you have to activate and pay them


Hm so my interpretation is wrong ? Where did I err here ?

Warden
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Re: Just bought the pdf so I've some questions

Postby Warden » Sat Aug 27, 2016 2:46 am

I'm a little confused now as how to include Ceremonies. This is all I can find on Ceremonies within the rules.

Page 308
"Ceremonies are the Blessed equivalent of magic rituals—at their core, ceremonies are liturgical chants, but they usually take more time to perform and have a much stronger effect."

Page 312
"Liturgical chants are not the only tools available to Blessed Ones. Most Churches and cults also use ceremonies, which take much more time and preparation but are still basically liturgical chants and use the same rules."

I think you just activate Ceremonies at character creation, and then raise them during character creation (and after play begins) like you do with skills? You can't buy them because they have no AP cost. At least that is how I see them; to be treated exactly like skills are when it comes to obtaining them and improving them.
Last edited by Warden on Sat Aug 27, 2016 5:04 am, edited 1 time in total.

bluedragon7
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Re: Just bought the pdf so I've some question

Postby bluedragon7 » Sat Aug 27, 2016 4:15 am

Try to look at it this way:
Cantrips, Spells and Rituals (and Blessings, Chants and Ceremonies) are just a system to grade the power. Cantrips and blessings are small in their impact, spells and chants moderate and rituals and ceremonies large (and time consuming)
In previous editions there were only chants grade 1-6 and they were divided up now.
For magic most cantrips were minor variants of spells and most of the rituals were regular spells before. There were some rituals in previous editions, mainly object rituals (like binding of objects and enhancing them.)
Especially Arcanovi and most summonings were labelled spells but effectively were time consuming rituals.

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MadBeard
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Re: Just bought the pdf so I've some questions

Postby MadBeard » Sat Aug 27, 2016 11:40 am

Warden wrote:I'm a little confused now as how to include Ceremonies. This is all I can find on Ceremonies within the rules.

Page 308
"Ceremonies are the Blessed equivalent of magic rituals—at their core, ceremonies are liturgical chants, but they usually take more time to perform and have a much stronger effect."

Page 312
"Liturgical chants are not the only tools available to Blessed Ones. Most Churches and cults also use ceremonies, which take much more time and preparation but are still basically liturgical chants and use the same rules."

I think you just activate Ceremonies at character creation, and then raise them during character creation (and after play begins) like you do with skills? You can't buy them because they have no AP cost. At least that is how I see them; to be treated exactly like skills are when it comes to obtaining them and improving them.


Take a look at that little graph on page 21. It clearly says that group SKILLS are made of skills, Chants and Spells.
You just quoted that ceremonies are like rituals.
Page 285, Aventurian Enchantments description
The three types of enchantments are spells, cantrips, and rituals. Spells are basically normal skills. Cantrips are minor magical effects that every spellcaster can learn, and their strength is minimal. Rituals are special spells that take an especially long time to prepare and cast, but basically work just like spells.


Page 306, Liturgical Chants, Ceremonies, Miracles, and Great Miracles

Blessed Ones of Aventuria have been using ritualized forms of god-given powers for centuries. We call these powers liturgical chants (see page 308) and ceremonies (see page 312). Rules-wise, both work similarly to other skills, and you use and improve them in the same way.


So, spells, rituals, chants, ceremonies are same as skills and they are treated like that. You must activate them to use them and are improved same as skills. Hence under each spell, ritual, chant and ceremony you have stat Improvement Cost: A, B, C or D, same as there is for skills.

I already gave you this advice but I'll do it once more because I see that you didn't manage to grasp book concept.
In almost every chapter you have "general rules" or description which explains how to properly read pages after that. If you missed that, you'll not understand what rules after mean.
So if you don't understand something, go back at the beginning of the chapter and check there if there is an explanation.
I'd have to be a warrior, a slave I couldn't be.
A soldier and a conqueror, fighting to be free.

"Warrior" - Wishbone Ash

Warden
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Re: Just bought the pdf so I've some questions

Postby Warden » Sat Aug 27, 2016 11:49 am

I think you just activate Ceremonies at character creation, and then raise them during character creation (and after play begins) like you do with skills

At least that is how I see them; to be treated exactly like skills are when it comes to obtaining them and improving them.

Flash
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Re: Just bought the pdf so I've some questions

Postby Flash » Sat Aug 27, 2016 12:34 pm

I think I begin to understand some Warden's problem here as I am currently somewhat confused about what exactly falls under the Spell/Liturgical Chants activation limit of page 39.

And it doesn't help that the English book chooses to translate the German "Zauber" with "Enchantments" in the definition box on page 253
That further muddles the waters and probable is a case for errata. I have the suspicion that the table on page 39 should have written:

Number of Enchantments/LiturgicalChants

instead of

Number of Spells/LiturgicalChants

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MadBeard
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Re: Just bought the pdf so I've some questions

Postby MadBeard » Sat Aug 27, 2016 12:50 pm

Flash wrote:I think I begin to understand some Warden's problem here as I am currently somewhat confused about what exactly falls under the Spell/Liturgical Chants activation limit of page 39.

And it doesn't help that the English book chooses to translate the German "Zauber" with "Enchantments" in the definition box on page 253
That further muddles the waters and probable is a case for errata. I have the suspicion that the table on page 39 should have written:

Number of Enchantments/LiturgicalChants

instead of

Number of Spells/LiturgicalChants


Nope, you're wrong Flash.

On page 39 is good. Number of Spells/LiturgicalChants.

Enchantments are cantrips, spells and rituals.
You don't have a limit to number of cantrips and rituals.
Same as you don't have a limit to number of blessings and ceremonies.

There is only limit to spells and chants.
I'd have to be a warrior, a slave I couldn't be.
A soldier and a conqueror, fighting to be free.

"Warrior" - Wishbone Ash

Flash
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Joined: Thu Jun 09, 2016 1:39 pm

Re: Just bought the pdf so I've some questions

Postby Flash » Sat Aug 27, 2016 1:26 pm

MadBeard wrote:
Nope, you're wrong Flash.

On page 39 is good. Number of Spells/LiturgicalChants.

Enchantments are cantrips, spells and rituals.
You don't have a limit to number of cantrips and rituals.
Same as you don't have a limit to number of blessings and ceremonies.

There is only limit to spells and chants.


That was my first interpretation as well a few posts before but I have some sneaking doubts now. I will check my German books later and take a look at some professions. Not only the base book but the Warring Kingdoms one as well as it has quite a number of magical professions as well.
Last edited by Flash on Sat Aug 27, 2016 1:29 pm, edited 1 time in total.


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