Lowest Armor value ? Confused by wording

User avatar
Plageman
Posts: 121
Joined: Fri Dec 30, 2016 3:21 pm
Location: Haguenau, France

Lowest Armor value ? Confused by wording

Postby Plageman » Sat Aug 10, 2019 3:39 pm

Please excuse me if the subject has been discussed before but I didn't find anything in the FAQ or in a fast forum search.

I'm very confused by regular reference by spell, elemental effects or monster abilities to the "lowest/worst Armor value". The reason is that TorgE does not have an Armor value but a Toughness value.

So my guess is that it is actually using the lowest Toughness, which is equal to bypassing the armor like the effect of a Called Shot. Am I reading that right ?

User avatar
Greymarch2000
Posts: 489
Joined: Fri Jul 28, 2017 7:48 pm

Re: Lowest Armor value ? Confused by wording

Postby Greymarch2000 » Sat Aug 10, 2019 4:09 pm

Essentially. If a character is Tou 8 and wearing torso armour that gives a +4 bonus to toughness they're generally Tou 12, but an effect that hits the lowest armour area would only be against Tou 8. It's the area with the lowest "bonus from armour".

User avatar
Plageman
Posts: 121
Joined: Fri Dec 30, 2016 3:21 pm
Location: Haguenau, France

Re: Lowest Armor value ? Confused by wording

Postby Plageman » Sat Aug 10, 2019 4:37 pm

Yeah but then if your wearing some full boy armor it's unclear if it still hits the low TOU since you can find some weak points in it...

graethynne
Posts: 86
Joined: Tue Jul 16, 2019 3:11 pm

Re: Lowest Armor value ? Confused by wording

Postby graethynne » Sat Aug 10, 2019 7:18 pm

Plageman wrote:Yeah but then if your wearing some full boy armor it's unclear if it still hits the low TOU since you can find some weak points in it...


I'm not sure with full body coverage you would be able to default to toughness only.

Take someone utilizing the Law of Masks in the NE. The armor is literally an abstraction from wearing the mask, so why wouldn't that armor apply?

It's also possible you could take the called shot penalty to ignore full body armor on something that defaults to "lowest armor", but that feels like a house rule rather taking the rules as they are.

Graethynne

vaminion
Posts: 99
Joined: Wed Oct 04, 2017 3:22 pm

Re: Lowest Armor value ? Confused by wording

Postby vaminion » Sat Aug 10, 2019 10:27 pm

Plageman wrote:Yeah but then if your wearing some full boy armor it's unclear if it still hits the low TOU since you can find some weak points in it...


The core book covers that.

The book says: wrote:Full body armor protects against fire and other attacks that target the lowest armor value of the subject


Full body is a quality on the armor itself. By RAW you can't gain it by adding a helmet to torso only armor like a kevlar vest.

User avatar
Rabbitball
Posts: 738
Joined: Mon Nov 14, 2016 7:41 pm

Re: Lowest Armor value ? Confused by wording

Postby Rabbitball » Sat Aug 10, 2019 10:43 pm

Armor has three pieces: torso, head, and leggings. Full body armor covers all three. Other armor misses one or more.
Dominick Riesland, aka Rabbitball
Co-author, Aysle Sourcebook for Torg Eternity
Creator of the Cosmversal Grimoire
"Those who will not follow are doomed to lead"—Anarchist, Magic: the Gathering

utsukushi
Posts: 881
Joined: Fri Feb 10, 2017 7:30 pm

Re: Lowest Armor value ? Confused by wording

Postby utsukushi » Sun Aug 11, 2019 1:57 am

Plageman wrote:I'm very confused by regular reference by spell, elemental effects or monster abilities to the "lowest/worst Armor value". The reason is that TorgE does not have an Armor value but a Toughness value.

I think it's also worth noting that TorgE definitely does have an Armor value, which generally adds to your Toughness, but Armor Piercing attacks also can only subtract as much from the target's Toughness as is coming from their armor. So AP 4 will ignore a Leather Jerkin or Armor of God equally, but all it can do is ignore the Armor itself. It doesn't subtract three more points from the Leather Jerkin wearer's actual Toughness.

User avatar
Atama
Posts: 981
Joined: Tue Jun 27, 2017 12:30 am
Location: Auburn, WA

Re: Lowest Armor value ? Confused by wording

Postby Atama » Sun Aug 11, 2019 5:12 am

utsukushi wrote:
Plageman wrote:I'm very confused by regular reference by spell, elemental effects or monster abilities to the "lowest/worst Armor value". The reason is that TorgE does not have an Armor value but a Toughness value.

I think it's also worth noting that TorgE definitely does have an Armor value, which generally adds to your Toughness, but Armor Piercing attacks also can only subtract as much from the target's Toughness as is coming from their armor. So AP 4 will ignore a Leather Jerkin or Armor of God equally, but all it can do is ignore the Armor itself. It doesn't subtract three more points from the Leather Jerkin wearer's actual Toughness.

The official Torg Eternity character sheet has a stat called “Armor” with a numerical value separate from the Toughness stat. It’s pretty explicit. :)
“You are a bad person, and should feel bad.”
-TorgHacker (being tongue-in-cheek :D)

User avatar
Plageman
Posts: 121
Joined: Fri Dec 30, 2016 3:21 pm
Location: Haguenau, France

Re: Lowest Armor value ? Confused by wording

Postby Plageman » Sun Aug 11, 2019 4:17 pm

Excuse me for being a bit pedantic, but there is no Armor value in TorgE since a value is a numer without a + or + in its front, there is an Armor bonus to TOU though :D

After re-reading all the entries I found in the core rules I came to understand what the intent of the wording is: the attack target a zone that is less armored (read not covered by the armor itself) and thus you only use the base TOU value. It's not armor piercing since full body armor do offer a protection against that type of attacks.

Again I find the wording used very confusing as it can be interpreted as needing to apply a lower version of the Armor bonus while in reality you just ignore the Armor bonus to TOU unless in Full Body armor.

User avatar
Atama
Posts: 981
Joined: Tue Jun 27, 2017 12:30 am
Location: Auburn, WA

Re: Lowest Armor value ? Confused by wording

Postby Atama » Sun Aug 11, 2019 7:53 pm

Plageman wrote:Excuse me for being a bit pedantic, but there is no Armor value in TorgE since a value is a numer without a + or + in its front, there is an Armor bonus to TOU though :D

There is literally an Armor value with no + or - qualifier on the character sheet I linked to. There is such a thing as an Armor value, pedantically speaking. You just add that value to Toughness when appropriate.
“You are a bad person, and should feel bad.”
-TorgHacker (being tongue-in-cheek :D)


Return to “Rules Questions (TORG)”

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 30 guests