Second Chance - who can play?

User avatar
Greymarch2000
Posts: 524
Joined: Fri Jul 28, 2017 7:48 pm

Re: Second Chance - who can play?

Postby Greymarch2000 » Mon Sep 30, 2019 11:43 am

graethynne wrote:This is really valuable insight, thank you folks.

The issue that I was afraid of is that since we have been playing Day 1s up to now, once they start playing characters they have built from scratch they will only become more capable. Though I expect the Day 1 threats are toned down a little too...

Graethynne


Torg PCs are very capable compared to other RPGs, especially characters they've made themselves vs the Day One pre-mades (depending on how cheesy your group is of course). As others have alluded to, letting them stomp over bad guys during Standard scenes is pretty much par for the course (and also used by experienced players to build up a "winning" hand of Destiny Cards for the finale).

Sometimes (especially in Beta+) though this can extend into the Dramatic scenes as well. The biggest thing I have to say is never forget to check for Fear at the beginning of a fight. I have forgotten this and made fights so much easier by accident so many times! :D If you characters are often blasting through the big bads in 1 or 2 rounds remember to use cover and concealment, and think of extending the range or adding more minions.

The concept is that it should take a few rounds for the SKs to build up a decent of Pool of cards before they can inflict the death blow. Generally they'll try to stock up Second Chance, Reality Storm, Opponent Fails (don't forget that one has been errataed!) and the like and blow it all on one big hit. Until you soak it. Then they'll start to appreciate the value of simply chipping away small amounts of shock or health from villains to make you wonder if it's worth spending a possibility to soak or not...

Some of my players have started to complain about it feeling like there's "no threat" but we've been playing in high-Beta for a while. Alpha characters still need to plan and work together, and Destiny card trading is a big part of that.

ZorValachan
Posts: 644
Joined: Fri Mar 03, 2017 9:02 pm

Re: Second Chance - who can play?

Postby ZorValachan » Mon Sep 30, 2019 12:19 pm

Another thing to remember is if there are multiple encounters within the same scene, cards get picked up out of the pool, but are not refilled/refreshed. And in certain situations there is not time for the characters to rest (or if they specifically press forward trying to get to an objective) they may not be able to heal shock. Last night my group (mid beta) had to retreat from standard edeinos, because of this. 4 of the 5 characters got KOed (one got revived by a potion). All from accumulated shock. One of the characters is a prisoner now. This is the first time this group faced defeat (and close to a TPK) and if my memory is correct also the first retreat/defeat ever in my 27+ years of GMing Torg. It was nail-biting exciting.

And if you're in beta and things are going too easy for the storm knights, don't forget to use the GM possibilities. They can turn a mook's little hit into something deadly.
- Leamon Crafton Jr.
Infiniverse Exchange author:

The Paraverse: An entire alternate Cosmverse
http://www.drivethrurpg.com/product/237607/

The Knights of the Road: Archtypes designed as a Storm Knight group
http://www.drivethrurpg.com/product/228365/

User avatar
Atama
Posts: 1088
Joined: Tue Jun 27, 2017 12:30 am
Location: Auburn, WA

Re: Second Chance - who can play?

Postby Atama » Mon Sep 30, 2019 1:13 pm

Opponent Fails and a Master Plan card have really screwed up a couple of fights for our GM.
“You are a bad person, and should feel bad.”
-TorgHacker (being tongue-in-cheek :D)

User avatar
Count Thalim
Posts: 275
Joined: Thu Mar 22, 2018 4:26 pm
Location: The Sceptered Asyle

Re: Second Chance - who can play?

Postby Count Thalim » Mon Sep 30, 2019 1:57 pm

Atama wrote:Opponent Fails and a Master Plan card have really screwed up a couple of fights for our GM.


I see your master plan/opponent fails and raise you Welcome to our world/opponent fails... :o
Per Sanguis Ad Astra

User avatar
Wotan
Posts: 473
Joined: Wed Aug 23, 2017 8:10 pm
Location: Aysle (UK)

Re: Second Chance - who can play?

Postby Wotan » Mon Sep 30, 2019 2:30 pm

Count Thalim wrote:
Atama wrote:Opponent Fails and a Master Plan card have really screwed up a couple of fights for our GM.


I see your master plan/opponent fails and raise you Welcome to our world/opponent fails... :o

I thought that there's been a clarification that Opponent Fails can only be played on tests which target the PC playing the card?
Could be imagining it though *shrug*

But, in general, Masterplan is very powerful card. My players once kept a Heroes Flurry going for 5 rounds of a Dramatic scene, through use of both Seize Initiative & both Masterplans. *sigh*
Non-denominational "Devil's Advocate"

utsukushi
Posts: 913
Joined: Fri Feb 10, 2017 7:30 pm

Re: Second Chance - who can play?

Postby utsukushi » Mon Sep 30, 2019 2:53 pm

Not imagining it! That's totally a thing.

And... :shock: That scene must have been very Dramatic, though, if it lasted through 10 Hero turns! Wow!

User avatar
Wotan
Posts: 473
Joined: Wed Aug 23, 2017 8:10 pm
Location: Aysle (UK)

Re: Second Chance - who can play?

Postby Wotan » Mon Sep 30, 2019 3:22 pm

utsukushi wrote:Not imagining it! That's totally a thing.

And... :shock: That scene must have been very Dramatic, though, if it lasted through 10 Hero turns! Wow!

It was the final scene of the NE Day 1, so 3 stormers, with waves of Shocktroopers vs my 4 players. Think there was one round before the mega-Flurry, and a final "mopping up" round afterwards, as the PCs tried to take down the surviving Stormers before they escaped into the sandstorm.

At 7 rounds (ok, 12 PC turns! :o ) it's probably the longest fight we've had in TorgE. One of the NPCs had Mind Control & was using it pretty effectively; for a couple of rounds the party grunt was chasing another PC around, trying to get a MacGuffin off him for the Villainess, so the party wasn't able to focus its full attention on defeating the villains. Good times. :)
Non-denominational "Devil's Advocate"

GeniusCodeMonkey
Posts: 467
Joined: Wed May 09, 2018 2:35 am

Re: Second Chance - who can play?

Postby GeniusCodeMonkey » Mon Sep 30, 2019 5:28 pm

Wotan wrote:
Kuildeous wrote:
GeniusCodeMonkey wrote:There are cards that can be played on anyone, Action etc.


Er, I thought that Action can only be played on yourself, much like Adrenaline and Willpower. Have I been running this incorrectly? Wouldn’t be the first time.

No I reckon you're right mate. Action specifies "Add +3 to the total of your test." So it seems fairly clear cut IMHO.

Having looked through the regular Destiny deck, the only card which specifies that it can be played on another player's tests is Supporter.
Glory's wording is ambiguous, "Play after a die roll of 60+...", so I lean towards letting any player use it when one of my players makes the roll, but I could see other GMs insisting that it has to be played by the player who made the roll.

You right. I was quoting from memory... and I have run for 4 weeks :cry:
Question everything.
Politeness costs nothing.

User avatar
Kuildeous
Posts: 1447
Joined: Mon Nov 14, 2016 1:41 pm

Re: Second Chance - who can play?

Postby Kuildeous » Tue Oct 01, 2019 7:09 am

Wotan wrote:Glory's wording is ambiguous, "Play after a die roll of 60+...", so I lean towards letting any player use it when one of my players makes the roll, but I could see other GMs insisting that it has to be played by the player who made the roll.


My cheeky players keep teasing me that they should be allowed to play Glory on a villain roll of 60+. So I retorted that sure they could play Glory and give all my bad guys +1 Possibility and an increase in hand size.

And while Leadership does help another player, it is specified that the one who played the card is the one who moves their cards into someone else's pool. Rally and Inspire are great examples of group cards though.
The Boneyard – Friends and foes within Tharkold's Blasted Land

Infiniverse Exchange Word template – Infiniverse Exchange template for MS Word users

utsukushi
Posts: 913
Joined: Fri Feb 10, 2017 7:30 pm

Re: Second Chance - who can play?

Postby utsukushi » Tue Oct 01, 2019 1:28 pm

I can actually see your cheeky players' case. (Your other cheeky players, I assume, because I don't remember this at all. :P ) But if you consider the argument that Glory doesn't necessarily mean the thing that just happened was amazing, but rather that you've got a hook for the amazing story of this whole adventure, a super high Villain role is possibly the most appropriate place to play it. What's more Glorious than overcoming someone who just walloped you like that??

And as Wotan quotes, it does say just "a die roll", where it could easily have been, say, "After you roll". I think there's a pretty good argument that it should be valid after any roll that goes over 60, whether it be PC, Villain... theoretically even a Bonus Die roll. I mean, that's a lot less likely, but how epic would that be??

I mean, I think we can agree it still has to be a valid in-game die roll. You can't just pick up a Backgammon doubling die, roll a 64, and say "Woot!" (Well, you can, but people will look at you funny. Just take my word for this and don't ask. :? )


Return to “Rules Questions (TORG)”

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 22 guests