Physical Adept?

vaminion
Posts: 103
Joined: Wed Oct 04, 2017 3:22 pm

Re: Physical Adept?

Postby vaminion » Wed Oct 09, 2019 9:56 am

The math's not there.

First you've got the action economy. 1 spell/round with ramping up penalties from concentration means that you're taking at least 1 round to come online, possibly more, until you get Magister/Multi-Tastker. Second there's the constant concentration checks with the aforementioned ramping penalties. Third, you get MAD; you need a casting stat, plus dex, plus strength, plus possibly spirit depending on the spells/powers you're trying to use. Finally, you're only ever one Player's Call away from having any or all of your buffs dispelled. What you end up with is a character who spends 1-3 rounds to hopefully reach parity with where the other Storm Knights at all times who then drops down to square one the second they fail a concentration check or the GM decides they've had enough of you and Interactions your buffs away.

When I tried to make it work on a Pan Pacifica Psychic I ended up just behind what our Wonder Woman's defenses but had nowhere near her offensive ability. I didn't have the raw destructive power of the Aysle mage (a lightning/mage hand user), the ability to target weaknesses like the Orrorsh alchemist/bulletsmith, or the magic of the Living Lands priest. That was before the telekinesis nerfs that rendered him illegal under RAW; he'd be even weaker now.

As others have said your best bet is to take completely unrelated perks like pulp powers, ki powers, or armor powers like Dragon Warrior and reskin them as an ongoing magical effect that's infused into your body.

mystic101
Posts: 312
Joined: Mon Oct 16, 2017 11:13 am

Re: Physical Adept?

Postby mystic101 » Wed Oct 09, 2019 10:15 am

Yeah, right now, RAW it doesn't work. It took a custom perk to reduce the MAD, free up the action economy, and end the concentration problems. I think the end result is pretty good, though, at addressing all those things.

utsukushi
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Re: Physical Adept?

Postby utsukushi » Wed Oct 09, 2019 11:39 am

I don't know.. I'm doing reasonably well with my semi-feral combat psychic, and she works exactly that way. She uses Telekinetic Barrier and Energize together on a regular basis, and I generally invoke TK Barrier first. In some ways it would make more sense to start with Energize - it has a higher DN, so it'd be better to roll without the Concentration penalty, *and* it doesn't use Concentration so it actually wouldn't interfere with the Barrier... but I usually want the Barrier starting on Round 1 and Energize on round two so the after-effect doesn't hit until the fight is (hopefully) over. It's almost like the designers thought of this. ;)

So yes, it does take her a couple rounds to ramp up, but I use Multi-Actions, and I spend Possibilities pretty freely to get those ready with high results. So she's contributing pretty well while she sets up, and when she has them both she is just... deadly, and nigh impervious, and by then you've got a couple cards out, so she usually doesn't need more Possibilities to keep going. She had to be built with Str, Dex, and Spi, so she is very weak to a couple of Interactions and could certainly be slowed down, but negating all of her bonuses would take an awful lot of them. And in combat, she's definitely not "reaching parity" with the rest of the group. I do worry that she's the kind of character that may be giving the GM trouble trying to challenge her without overwhelming everyone else, though I have noticed that he's definitely adapting. :evil:

And despite being a solid example of what somebody was noting recently about being able to make a solidly min-maxed character -- er, I mean, "a character who is already very good at what I built her for" -- out of the box, she still has lots of room to grow.

If I were doing the same thing with more of a magic base - Haste immediately takes out the multi-action penalty, and it's not Concentration based. Given that Eternity is already built to encourage the players having a rough time in round 1 and then cleverly piecing together an overwhelming victory usually by round 5, I think a character who gets stronger over a couple of rounds is entirely viable.

Edit: OK, it' s a little weird to realize I have two characters who are basically physical adepts! So yes, I will say in my opinion, it's possible. :lol:

GeniusCodeMonkey
Posts: 465
Joined: Wed May 09, 2018 2:35 am

Re: Physical Adept?

Postby GeniusCodeMonkey » Wed Oct 09, 2019 12:55 pm

I like the concept of a physical adept.

My character idea would be a PP, suit wearing, yakuza with buffs powered by Psionic Tattoos. He would take martial arts. Psionic Tattoos would give him 3 to choose from to start, then two for each perks...

    Armour... +2 armour

    Elemental fist ... depends on chosen element see NE rays but only in melee

    Fist of fury ... +1 action for 3 rounds

    Hold breath... mind/spirit? value in minutes for holding breath

    Great leap... enhanced leaping

    Shadow self... smokey shadows surrounds you hiding you from sight and sound. +4 stealth for x minutes.

    Portal.. short range self teleport 25 metres fatigues.
    ????

... or something like that.
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Wakshani
Posts: 400
Joined: Wed Jul 12, 2017 9:53 pm

Re: Physical Adept?

Postby Wakshani » Wed Oct 09, 2019 2:21 pm

Oh yeah, there're tons of ways to build your own perk tree to do it as well.

(Sadly, I didn't get to write up the Physical Adept rules for this edition of Shadowrun, but maybe down the road.)

Zackzenobi
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Re: Physical Adept?

Postby Zackzenobi » Thu Oct 10, 2019 8:23 am

mystic101 wrote:The Elven Monk will feel and operate a lot like a physical adept. From what I remember, Shadowrun's physical adepts didn't pump themselves up with temporary magic effects. Rather, they infused magic into their bodies on a more long-term basis.

Ayslish monks will have a perk that, among other things, alters how the Law of Enchantment affects them. The enchantments will go into them, rather than their equipment, in order for them to regularly accomplish a variety of wu xia-like effects.

And, while not part of the starting chassis of the archetype, I specifically left some design space for temporary spell buffs by name-checking a few sub-orders of monks that dabble in spells, in addition to their normal base abilities.


This is an Amazing Idea! How did you come up with that?

Now I cant wait to to see what everyone else comes up with. Wishing there was time to change my Archetype to rival this. :D

And yes I need to play one of these...

mystic101
Posts: 312
Joined: Mon Oct 16, 2017 11:13 am

Re: Physical Adept?

Postby mystic101 » Thu Oct 10, 2019 11:45 am

Zackzenobi wrote: This is an Amazing Idea! How did you come up with that?


Well, I wanted to stay true to the spirit of the original archetype in some key ways, and as originally presented they’re definitely non-materialistic ascetics. That’s an issue under the new rules, with Aysle’s Law of Enchantment throwing out enhancements left and right, whenever a character does something amazing. The old monk relied on their own abilities and wouldn’t use that magically enhanced stuff. I didn’t want someone playing a monk to be at a disadvantage as compared to a normal Ayslish character. It occurred to me that I could kill two birds with one stone by shifting the effect onto them personally, as it both allowed them to keep the equivalent advantages from the LoE, while also reinforcing the physical adept angle.

Plus, as an aside, it always bothered me in D&D when supposedly ascetic high level monks were walking around in hundreds of thousands of gp’s worth of gear, that could feed whole villages of people for years on end, if they’d just sold it off instead of holding onto it. I thought that getting rid of the incentive to accumulate “leet gear” would make it easier for a player to lean in to that ascetic mindset, if they wanted to give it a try.

Zackzenobi wrote:Now I cant wait to to see what everyone else comes up with. Wishing there was time to change my Archetype to rival this. :D

And yes I need to play one of these...


Thanks! I’m sure your archetype will be awesome, and I hope mine will also bring plenty of joy to others. I’m looking forward to seeing what else comes out, myself. I’ve found several of the backer contributions to be very valuable in my own personal play.

QuarrelBlue
Posts: 166
Joined: Thu Dec 06, 2018 12:09 pm

Re: Physical Adept?

Postby QuarrelBlue » Fri Oct 11, 2019 7:14 am

Finding that a Physical Adept can be a Weapon Master, I searched for another way to enchant one's own body...and here it is:

General Gears can have enchantment like Skill +1, Favoring, or Mitigating, and the Gear can be Tribal Tattoos(or Ayslish equivalent of it) from the Core Rulebook. So, for example, if you wear Tribal Tattoos enchanted with Skill +1: Melee Weapons and Favoring: Melee weapons as a Heirloom, you essentially have your magic tattooed into your body for improved swordsmanship!
(And, as long as I understand the output from the Character Generator correctly, it is as legit as wearing an amulet of swordsmanship.)

You can also purchase some enchantment with Wealthy, and Tribal Paint is more affordable for that, but Favoring is too expensive for this so it is for one of multiple minor enchanted items.

You can't get Weapon-only enchantment like Damage increase or Wounding this way, but your Tattoo Magic works on you regardless of whatever weapon you use(as long as the weapon can be handled with the enchanted skill).

mystic101
Posts: 312
Joined: Mon Oct 16, 2017 11:13 am

Re: Physical Adept?

Postby mystic101 » Fri Oct 11, 2019 8:58 am

QuarrelBlue wrote:Finding that a Physical Adept can be a Weapon Master, I searched for another way to enchant one's own body...and here it is:

General Gears can have enchantment like Skill +1, Favoring, or Mitigating, and the Gear can be Tribal Tattoos(or Ayslish equivalent of it) from the Core Rulebook. So, for example, if you wear Tribal Tattoos enchanted with Skill +1: Melee Weapons and Favoring: Melee weapons as a Heirloom, you essentially have your magic tattooed into your body for improved swordsmanship!
(And, as long as I understand the output from the Character Generator correctly, it is as legit as wearing an amulet of swordsmanship.)

You can also purchase some enchantment with Wealthy, and Tribal Paint is more affordable for that, but Favoring is too expensive for this so it is for one of multiple minor enchanted items.

You can't get Weapon-only enchantment like Damage increase or Wounding this way, but your Tattoo Magic works on you regardless of whatever weapon you use(as long as the weapon can be handled with the enchanted skill).


Oooh, good idea!

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Spatula
Posts: 1028
Joined: Fri Jun 30, 2017 7:00 pm

Re: Physical Adept?

Postby Spatula » Fri Oct 11, 2019 11:12 am

QuarrelBlue wrote:Finding that a Physical Adept can be a Weapon Master, I searched for another way to enchant one's own body...and here it is:

General Gears can have enchantment like Skill +1, Favoring, or Mitigating, and the Gear can be Tribal Tattoos(or Ayslish equivalent of it) from the Core Rulebook. So, for example, if you wear Tribal Tattoos enchanted with Skill +1: Melee Weapons and Favoring: Melee weapons as a Heirloom, you essentially have your magic tattooed into your body for improved swordsmanship!
(And, as long as I understand the output from the Character Generator correctly, it is as legit as wearing an amulet of swordsmanship.)

You can also purchase some enchantment with Wealthy, and Tribal Paint is more affordable for that, but Favoring is too expensive for this so it is for one of multiple minor enchanted items.

You can't get Weapon-only enchantment like Damage increase or Wounding this way, but your Tattoo Magic works on you regardless of whatever weapon you use(as long as the weapon can be handled with the enchanted skill).

The rules for the Skill enchant say, "Test must use item enchanted" and "The enchanted item provides a bonus to the skill being tested when the item is used," so applying it to a tattoo is debatable? I suppose you're moving your body to make melee attacks & to defend oneself, and the tattoo is on the body...


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