Faith & Transformation

mrroderick
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Faith & Transformation

Postby mrroderick » Sat Oct 12, 2019 8:22 am

When a PC transforms, they are required to rebuild their perks to suit the new cosm. How does this work with faith-based perks? Specifically, since Optant & Gotak are in the LL book and the Faith category in that book lists LL as a pre-req, does the Optant or Gotak STOP being an Optant or Gotak?

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Count Thalim
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Re: Faith & Transformation

Postby Count Thalim » Sat Oct 12, 2019 8:58 am

I would say yes. Their new reality doesn't accept their being an Optant or Gotak.
They would convert to a similar equivalent in their new reality. A cyberpriest or druid for example.

They might still have faith but it won't be the same Faith...
Per Sanguis Ad Astra

Wakshani
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Re: Faith & Transformation

Postby Wakshani » Sat Oct 12, 2019 11:12 am

Yeah, they might keep the same religion but lose access to all those miracles.

Currently, there're no perks that allow cross-pollination of cosm in regards to miracles or magic. That is to say, if you're from Core Earth, you can't gain Living Land miracles even if you convert to that faith, unless you convert to that Reality. Similarly, if you're from Core Earth and go to the UK to study magic at Pigpimble's Academy, you can only learn Core Earth spells, not any from Aysle, unless you transform.

The Beta Primer has a perk that allows you to dip into the perk tree from other cosms, but it doesn't get around the core limitation of miracles and spells that you only have llist X to pull from.

You can make a fix for that, of course, but as it stands, it's a hard limit.

Savioronedge
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Re: Faith & Transformation

Postby Savioronedge » Sat Oct 12, 2019 12:53 pm

ROCE does have a perk to allow a Miracle from a different cosm.

Wakshani
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Re: Faith & Transformation

Postby Wakshani » Sat Oct 12, 2019 1:45 pm

Savioronedge wrote:ROCE does have a perk to allow a Miracle from a different cosm.


ROCE? Can you fill that out?

Savioronedge
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Re: Faith & Transformation

Postby Savioronedge » Sat Oct 12, 2019 2:48 pm

Wakshani wrote:
Savioronedge wrote:ROCE does have a perk to allow a Miracle from a different cosm.


ROCE? Can you fill that out?

Religions of Core Earth

Perk is Religious Pluralist

Note : Every game I have ever played (exception: Old Torg) has been Tech-centric or Item-centric. For Eternity, there is nothing explicitly stopping a Gotak from picking up and using a Godmeter...the nearly universal 4case contradiction should be a deterrent, but the Gotak is even allowed to gain skill in an item he can't even imagine. Meanwhile, the Core Earth Druid needs a Beta Clearance Perk to get the Shape Plant or Grasping Vines miracle despite the stories of his great, great, great, great grandmother using those miracles against the Roman Invaders.

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Spatula
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Re: Faith & Transformation

Postby Spatula » Tue Oct 15, 2019 3:03 am

Savioronedge wrote:Note : Every game I have ever played (exception: Old Torg) has been Tech-centric or Item-centric. For Eternity, there is nothing explicitly stopping a Gotak from picking up and using a Godmeter...the nearly universal 4case contradiction should be a deterrent, but the Gotak is even allowed to gain skill in an item he can't even imagine. Meanwhile, the Core Earth Druid needs a Beta Clearance Perk to get the Shape Plant or Grasping Vines miracle despite the stories of his great, great, great, great grandmother using those miracles against the Roman Invaders.

Are there such stories? I'm genuinely curious. Shape plant just makes items out of plants so I'm guessing probably not for that one, anyway. Grasping vines is a lot like the quintessential low-level D&D druid spell entangle, but was that something attributed to actual druids, or just an invention of D&D? (or did D&D steal it from somewhere else) If a character is going to use a Beta perk to grab a nature-themed miracle from another faith, might as well go for the big guns like earthquake.

There is kind of an issue with casters vs. tool users on that front because the casters are limited by whichever lists they have access to. Versus physical objects that anyone can pick up and try to use. But I think pretty much all the Core Earth miracle lists in the Living Land book and Religions of Core Earth actually do include miracles that are contradictory in present-day CE. And the Neopagan list in Religions of Core Earth is actually very suitable out-of-the-box for a neo-druid, IMO.

(though the official druid archetype is a divine magic-user)
Last edited by Spatula on Tue Oct 15, 2019 10:41 am, edited 1 time in total.

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Atama
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Re: Faith & Transformation

Postby Atama » Tue Oct 15, 2019 9:14 am

Historical information on real-life druids is scant. They are mostly figures of legend. There are druids in Irish Folklore, and druids written about by Roman scholars, but many historians question their existence at all.

The oldest records we have for their existence come from Romans who wrote about the “primitive” people they encountered in what is Western Europe today, and at the time the Roman Empire was trying to justify its expansion by telling of how “barbarians” lived outside of its borders and may have embellished or invented stories about druids.

Irish Folklore is colored by Christianity’s attempt to portray older pagan beliefs as heretical. Irish literature defines druids as sorcerers, and the word “druid” itself, though with no clear etymology, seems to be derived at least in part from drui/draoi which means “wizard” or “seer”.

There are apocryphal tales of Greek texts dating to 300 BCE that may have referenced druids (as “barbarian philosophers”) but those texts are lost, and the only evidence we have of their existence are from a Roman writer who quoted them 500 years later. One, by the way, was reportedly a text on magic written by Aristotle.

Basically we are unsure of what druids were or if there ever were any. They were sometimes referred to as priests but most of the stories have them as magical advisers to kings (similar to Merlin, whose story was inspired by druidic tales). Their most common ability spoken of was telling the future, though some druids can summon storms and otherwise call upon the power of nature.

Basically, there is more support in literature for a magical druid than a priestly one.
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utsukushi
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Re: Faith & Transformation

Postby utsukushi » Tue Oct 15, 2019 10:34 am

...And brewing potions of Strength Enhancement for small gaulish villages, of course.

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Spatula
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Re: Faith & Transformation

Postby Spatula » Tue Oct 15, 2019 10:44 am

Thanks, Atama. I've done some reading on the subject but not enough to say anything for certain.


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