Beta Doesn't seam to be a big enough deal

Sir Awesome
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Beta Doesn't seam to be a big enough deal

Postby Sir Awesome » Mon May 13, 2019 9:27 am

So my group has been playing torg for awhile, and we are a very high power gaming/rules crunching group. One discussion that we have been having off and on in the last several sessions as we are now solidly in beta clearance is that the system seams very front loaded.

By this we mean that for almost every character we build the perks/spells that will decide how my character plays are taken immediately with the perks that just give us a couple of adds to what we are doing are taken last.

I never expected there to be a lot of beta clearance items in the base book, but I would have expected more in the cosm books.

Personally I don't feel that there are enough meaningful choices to make that require beta clearance or above.

Thoughts?

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Atama
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Re: Beta Doesn't seam to be a big enough deal

Postby Atama » Mon May 13, 2019 9:50 am

I’m saving up on my PC right now because we’re not Beta Clearance yet. Once we get there I will have a number of Perks that weren’t available to me before. It seems like a big deal to me, from a character growth perspective.
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fougerec
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Re: Beta Doesn't seam to be a big enough deal

Postby fougerec » Mon May 13, 2019 10:34 am

In my mind Beta Clearance level isn't about more powerful perks but about simply more of everything. Higher skills, more perks, more spells, higher attributes etc. We just finished our 30th game (and I consider each session one Act for XP (so 150xp) it's just much, much easier to remember). So the characters now have a much broader base of abilities and in their areas of focus they are pretty darn good with skills in the 15-18 range.

IMO that's what the "big deal" is about Beta

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Spatula
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Re: Beta Doesn't seam to be a big enough deal

Postby Spatula » Mon May 13, 2019 11:04 am

I imagine more beta (and gamma) stuff will be coming in "year 2" and later. The big deal, as fougerec says, isn't so much that there are suddenly fireworks, but that the characters have base values so high they can handle normal obstacles without spending possibilities.

EDIT: And hey, Cosm Adaptation is potentially a big deal, though it's only open to Core Earth characters at Beta.
Last edited by Spatula on Tue May 14, 2019 1:51 am, edited 1 time in total.

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Atama
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Re: Beta Doesn't seam to be a big enough deal

Postby Atama » Mon May 13, 2019 11:05 am

fougerec wrote:In my mind Beta Clearance level isn't about more powerful perks but about simply more of everything. Higher skills, more perks, more spells, higher attributes etc. We just finished our 30th game (and I consider each session one Act for XP (so 150xp) it's just much, much easier to remember). So the characters now have a much broader base of abilities and in their areas of focus they are pretty darn good with skills in the 15-18 range.

IMO that's what the "big deal" is about Beta

That’s a really good way to put it. You’re not necessarily getting access to better stuff, just more of it. I’m eager for Beta because there are Perks I want that have it as a requirement. But they’re not “better”, they’re just something I think fits my PC.
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Tangent
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Re: Beta Doesn't seam to be a big enough deal

Postby Tangent » Mon May 13, 2019 11:06 am

From my perspective as someone who is designing a homebrew cosm to participate in the Possibility Wars on Core Earth, the Beta Clearance Guides are helping me shape my Perks for Ahzad-Tol by giving me an idea of how powerful they should be, and which ones should be possibility activated and which ones default to always on.

Yes, I'm trying to keep my homebrew cosm more or less balanced with the official ones. We just want our sword & sorcery setting included in our campaign, not for it to dominate everything in the campaign.

And before anyone asks, the difference between the pulp fantasy sword and sorcery genre we're trying to emulate with Ahzad-Tol and the high fantasy genre more or less presented by Aysle is Aysle's focus on the distinction between the forces of Light and Dark and Ahzad-Tol lacks such a delineated distinction and the heroes can be just as flawed as the villains.

Think of Aysle being represented by Lord of the Rings, and Ahzad-Tol being represented by Conan, Red Sonja, or Game of Thrones...
Last edited by Tangent on Tue May 14, 2019 12:39 am, edited 1 time in total.

Zackzenobi
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Re: Beta Doesn't seam to be a big enough deal

Postby Zackzenobi » Mon May 13, 2019 10:10 pm

I'm jealous that you guys get to role play often enough to level up to Beta. I've actually only got to play a one person 1 act adventure. I was working weekends for a while. Just got my Saturdays free! Heres hoping!!!

Tangent
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Re: Beta Doesn't seam to be a big enough deal

Postby Tangent » Tue May 14, 2019 1:36 am

Zackzenobi wrote:I'm jealous that you guys get to role play often enough to level up to Beta. I've actually only got to play a one person 1 act adventure. I was working weekends for a while. Just got my Saturdays free! Heres hoping!!!


We're still only on mission five, so we've actually got a ways to go before we reach Beta clearance in our campaign.

But since I'm designing a homebrew sword & sorcery cosm at my GM's request, I need to plan ahead and make sure that the Perks I make for it are balanced with the rest of the official material. I want to avoid power creep as much as the new devs do.

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Gargoyle
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Re: Beta Doesn't seam to be a big enough deal

Postby Gargoyle » Wed May 15, 2019 7:44 am

Beta is a little weird because the GM gets a big power boost while players just get access to powerful new perks which they may not really want or need, or be able to afford right away. So it can feel like a nerf for some a buff or a wash for others. But in reality it's mostly just a milestone. You're getting more powerful every Act and by the time you get to Beta, yes you're pretty badass. It's just that the access to beta perks and requisitions is not a big bump, possibly because some groups haven't planned prerequisites to unlock the really good stuff in there and there aren't that many beta perks available yet.
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Kuildeous
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Re: Beta Doesn't seam to be a big enough deal

Postby Kuildeous » Wed May 15, 2019 9:49 am

Gargoyle wrote:Beta is a little weird because the GM gets a big power boost while players just get access to powerful new perks which they may not really want or need, or be able to afford right away. So it can feel like a nerf for some a buff or a wash for others. But in reality it's mostly just a milestone. You're getting more powerful every Act and by the time you get to Beta, yes you're pretty badass. It's just that the access to beta perks and requisitions is not a big bump, possibly because some groups haven't planned prerequisites to unlock the really good stuff in there and there aren't that many beta perks available yet.


I could see a gradual power curve for the GM in Beta. Like when the Storm Knights hit Beta, the GM gains 1 Possibility per Storm Knight. After, say 100 or 150 XP, it jumps up to 2 Possibilities per Storm Knight. And maybe it ramps up to 3 at the high end of Beta. I can't remember what Gamma does for the GM. I'm not close to that yet.
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