Casting into melee

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TorgHacker
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Re: Casting into melee

Postby TorgHacker » Wed Feb 13, 2019 4:01 pm

After discussing further with Darrell, he's agreed with my interpretation.

If it targets dodge, then it counts as Firing into Melee.
Deanna Gilbert
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Savioronedge
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Re: Casting into melee

Postby Savioronedge » Wed Feb 13, 2019 11:44 pm

I like options. That was my favorite thing about OT which was limited in TE...Oprions were wide open: ie. "You want to play a Spell slinging Martial Artist with Psionics and flight? It will take a while and we'll need to start thusly, but we can do it." Now it is (As far as I can tell) totally impossible to build that character.

My point is, I like options to be available; you want to make a ranged character who shoots into melee without hurting your friends? Here's a Perk you should take...You want to make a melee character though all your friends made ranged fighters and you don't want to suffer friendly fire? Here's a Perk you should take. Your group is split ranged and melee? Here are some perks and here are some strategies.

Options.
Our Shadowrun game ended when my Troll Physical Adept took a rocket launcher to the chest and almost died, reminding the GM just how deadly combat could be in that game. In TE, his option would be to get up and tie the enemy into a melee fight while everyone else shoots into the combat. Fezig would pretty much ignore small arms fire so the odd [all puns intemded] friendly fire would be forgiven [although I can't make a character like him anymore, not even at Beta, that I can see.]

Gargoyle wrote:Lately I've allowed them to break the rules in all sorts of ways by spending a possibility. It works pretty well. Our psychic wanted to control one of two enemy speedboats and crash them into each other. I felt like it was a Water Vehicles check, using Kinesis to make it do-able at a distance, telekinetically grabbing the wheel and turning it at the right moment, but rather than say no, that skill is untrained, I just said I'll let you make a Water Vehicle check for a possibility. And then he spent another on the roll, got a player's call and smashed them together <cue big explosion>. Very fun.

This is beautiful--Options!

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Kuildeous
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Re: Casting into melee

Postby Kuildeous » Wed Feb 13, 2019 11:55 pm

Savioronedge wrote:I like options. That was my favorite thing about OT which was limited in TE...Oprions were wide open: ie. "You want to play a Spell slinging Martial Artist with Psionics and flight? It will take a while and we'll need to start thusly, but we can do it." Now it is (As far as I can tell) totally impossible to build that character.


You can do it in TE too. And like OT, it will take a while. Cosm Adaptability can get you this type of character, though it'll be a bit expensive.

I know Deanna's been suggesting that people invent their own perks. Hmm, actually a perk thread could be neat. That way, a GM can double-check himself before allowing a new perk.Being able to shoot into melee without risk sounds like a reasonable perk.
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Gargoyle
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Re: Casting into melee

Postby Gargoyle » Thu Feb 14, 2019 8:14 am

TorgHacker wrote:After discussing further with Darrell, he's agreed with my interpretation.

If it targets dodge, then it counts as Firing into Melee.


Great, I think that fits the core rules and the narrative of those abilities better.
"That old chestnut?"

Gargoyle

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TorgHacker
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Re: Casting into melee

Postby TorgHacker » Thu Feb 14, 2019 8:50 am

Kuildeous wrote:
Savioronedge wrote:I like options. That was my favorite thing about OT which was limited in TE...Oprions were wide open: ie. "You want to play a Spell slinging Martial Artist with Psionics and flight? It will take a while and we'll need to start thusly, but we can do it." Now it is (As far as I can tell) totally impossible to build that character.


You can do it in TE too. And like OT, it will take a while. Cosm Adaptability can get you this type of character, though it'll be a bit expensive.

I know Deanna's been suggesting that people invent their own perks. Hmm, actually a perk thread could be neat. That way, a GM can double-check himself before allowing a new perk.Being able to shoot into melee without risk sounds like a reasonable perk.


A lot of house rules can easily be handled as a Perk, and that makes them not even house rules. We've never said "Thou must only use Perks we write". I mean, we've never said, "Thou must follow all of our rules to the letter." either but I know from personal experience that many don't like to house rule.

Perk design is more of an art than a science, but I generally go by these principles:

1. If the ability is fairly frequently used, it should be a minor boost. If it is very situational, it should be something more powerful.

2. It can be a more powerful ability also if you give the Perk significant prerequisites such that it does take a lot of resources to get it, especially if those prereqs are other Perks. (e.g. Storm Caller).

That said, if I were to design a Perk to avoiding hitting friends in melee, the person who should be getting that Perk is the person who is doing the shooting.
Deanna Gilbert
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ryric
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Re: Casting into melee

Postby ryric » Thu Feb 14, 2019 9:26 am

You haven't seen friendly fire truly happen until your group plays a Glory card on a shot that hits an ally.

It's probably just the dynamics of my group, but our melee guys are many times more effective than our gun fighters. Huge Strength+big weapons means base damage in the 15-19 range, and they have Toughness to match so enemy attacks barely faze them (at least from mooks). I generally get one damage 13 round of shots off, then switch to using maneuver to set up guys for the melee or using psionics like Awareness and Foreshadow.

If there was a Perk to make firing into melee safer, I would certainly put it on my to-do list. Perks are getting expensive, though. We just hit 150 xp in our group and I think my next perk is going to cost 17.

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Re: Casting into melee

Postby Sunrunner » Thu Feb 14, 2019 10:13 am

Wow I am impressed with my ability to start stuff.

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Gargoyle
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Re: Casting into melee

Postby Gargoyle » Thu Feb 14, 2019 10:44 am

Sunrunner wrote:Wow I am impressed with my ability to start stuff.


You should see what happens when you ask about vehicle ownership.
"That old chestnut?"

Gargoyle

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Gargoyle
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Re: Casting into melee

Postby Gargoyle » Thu Feb 14, 2019 10:45 am

ryric wrote:You haven't seen friendly fire truly happen until your group plays a Glory card on a shot that hits an ally.


+1
"That old chestnut?"

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Re: Casting into melee

Postby fougerec » Thu Feb 14, 2019 12:30 pm

Rather than putting the onus on the shooter, what if it was a perk for the melee guy.

Something like Mobile Combatant
Prereq - Dexterity 9+
The character is adapt at ducking and weaving in melee and does not count as a possible target for the firing into melee rules.

If you need to buff it a but maybe they also don't count as being engaged for potential AOE targets


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