Aysle Preview #2 - Magic

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Gargoyle
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Re: Aysle Preview #2 - Magic

Postby Gargoyle » Thu Apr 04, 2019 4:19 pm

She didn't say "ancient fans". I probably burned that brain cell.
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Sword of Spirit
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Re: Aysle Preview #2 - Magic

Postby Sword of Spirit » Thu Apr 04, 2019 6:48 pm

I especially like the way the cantrips rules are looking. Pretty cool!

One thing I'd be interested in seeing would be an explanation for some of the entries on the Magic Axiom chart.

For instance, there are several entries that mention "rituals" as distinct from spells, with indication that casting length is part of what defines a ritual, and rituals are accessible at a substantially lower axiom level than spells.

The core rulebook also gives the casting of a ritual as the example dramatic skill resolution.

Are rituals intended to remain purely as plot devices? If so that's fine (and much preferable to strictly limiting how many you can know), but if there are going to be more concrete explanations, this book might be a good place to address it, along with other lingering questions about magic in general. I'd prefer if rituals were theoretically possible for anyone with the right skills (as in the dramatic skill resolution example), but if not, that would be useful to know also.

Other things that are mentioned on the axiom chart but not explained include Permanent spells and Improvised magic.

I'm not sure how long the cantrip list is going to be, but it would be cool if a note were made that it wasn't intended to be comprehensive, and that other similar effects can exist at the GM's discretion. It would be really cool if there were a Perk (maybe higher clearance) that allowed casters from other cosms to pick up cantrip capability outside of Aysle.

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Kuildeous
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Re: Aysle Preview #2 - Magic

Postby Kuildeous » Thu Apr 04, 2019 11:20 pm

TorgHacker wrote:Yeah....I have... thoughts, and I really wanted to avoid the whole "the first splatbook" problem that...all systems I think have. But I'm sure we'll give Lanala more love at some point.


Could be some stretch goals to update the Lanala miracle list as the books get better. Power creep is an easy trap to fall into, but updating the older stuff can mitigate some of that.
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Padre
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Re: Aysle Preview #2 - Magic

Postby Padre » Fri Apr 05, 2019 12:33 am

Sword of Spirit wrote:Are rituals intended to remain purely as plot devices? If so that's fine (and much preferable to strictly limiting how many you can know), but if there are going to be more concrete explanations, this book might be a good place to address it, along with other lingering questions about magic in general. I'd prefer if rituals were theoretically possible for anyone with the right skills (as in the dramatic skill resolution example), but if not, that would be useful to know also.

Other things that are mentioned on the axiom chart but not explained include Permanent spells and Improvised magic.

I'm definitely interested on the permanent and improvised magic as well.

In terms of rituals, I think we'll get some more info when we see the Core Earth Religions book from the NE kickstarter. IIRC, it's supposed to have some info on rituals and I suspect we can translate it over to magic rituals fairly easily.

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Re: Aysle Preview #2 - Magic

Postby GeniusCodeMonkey » Fri Apr 05, 2019 3:09 am

I love cantrips but, I think that if cantrips are supposed to be simple spells that are usable by anyone, then shouldn't there difficulty by Very Easy (6).

With a basic attribute of 7 then everyone should be able to perform them at least 55% of the time unskilled (if that's possible in Aysle). If your skilled (+1/8) this increases to 65% of the time and if your an expert (+3/10) this is 75% of the time.

Of course most PCs have attributes of 9 or 10 for their main magic skill, so it becomes even easier (10+3 adds is around 85% success rate).

Decreasing the cantrip difficulty will also give the feel of a magical cosm as cantrips will be used by everyone as they succeed more times than not.
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TorgHacker
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Re: Aysle Preview #2 - Magic

Postby TorgHacker » Fri Apr 05, 2019 9:58 am

GeniusCodeMonkey wrote:I love cantrips but, I think that if cantrips are supposed to be simple spells that are usable by anyone, then shouldn't there difficulty by Very Easy (6).

With a basic attribute of 7 then everyone should be able to perform them at least 55% of the time unskilled (if that's possible in Aysle). If your skilled (+1/8) this increases to 65% of the time and if your an expert (+3/10) this is 75% of the time.

Of course most PCs have attributes of 9 or 10 for their main magic skill, so it becomes even easier (10+3 adds is around 85% success rate).

Decreasing the cantrip difficulty will also give the feel of a magical cosm as cantrips will be used by everyone as they succeed more times than not.


There are cantrips that are Very Easy.
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GeniusCodeMonkey
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Re: Aysle Preview #2 - Magic

Postby GeniusCodeMonkey » Fri Apr 05, 2019 2:38 pm

TorgHacker wrote:
GeniusCodeMonkey wrote:I love cantrips but, I think that if cantrips are supposed to be simple spells that are usable by anyone, then shouldn't there difficulty by Very Easy (6).

With a basic attribute of 7 then everyone should be able to perform them at least 55% of the time unskilled (if that's possible in Aysle). If your skilled (+1/8) this increases to 65% of the time and if your an expert (+3/10) this is 75% of the time.

Of course most PCs have attributes of 9 or 10 for their main magic skill, so it becomes even easier (10+3 adds is around 85% success rate).

Decreasing the cantrip difficulty will also give the feel of a magical cosm as cantrips will be used by everyone as they succeed more times than not.


There are cantrips that are Very Easy.


Excellent!

I look forward to creating a macgyver thief with lots of cantrips.
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pkitty
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Re: Aysle Preview #2 - Magic

Postby pkitty » Fri Apr 05, 2019 3:29 pm

Love this preview. I was expecting Asyle spellcasters to get a massive bump in terms of options and utility, and that's exactly what we're getting, without them becoming OP.

Curious, if "disfavored" is being introduced specifically in the Asyle book, does that mean that it's a condition that will be specific to abilities and rules from that cosm? Or is this something that's going to be gradually ported back into Torg as a whole?

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Re: Aysle Preview #2 - Magic

Postby Atama » Fri Apr 05, 2019 4:44 pm

Reading over this preview again I think I see a discrepancy and/or typo...

In the “Arcane Knowledges” section it lists (what seem to be) four categories... Essences, Mixed Forces, Kindred, and Elements. I say it seems that those are four categories but it’s a bit tough to tell because there’s an unclosed set of parentheses that I think should be closed after “True Knowledge” going by context.

Later, it says that specialists choose a Perk to specialize in Elemental Magic, Essence Magic, Kindred Magic, or Principle Magic. Those 4 categories seem to match the list of 4 Arcane Knowledges except for “Mixed Forces” and “Principle Magic”.

Is that just a coincidence or did one of those terms get changed, with that change not making it into the preview? (I’m hoping that “Mixed Forces” was changed to “Principles”, as the former seems more awkward than the latter.)
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Re: Aysle Preview #2 - Magic

Postby TorgHacker » Fri Apr 05, 2019 6:26 pm

pkitty wrote:Love this preview. I was expecting Asyle spellcasters to get a massive bump in terms of options and utility, and that's exactly what we're getting, without them becoming OP.

Curious, if "disfavored" is being introduced specifically in the Asyle book, does that mean that it's a condition that will be specific to abilities and rules from that cosm? Or is this something that's going to be gradually ported back into Torg as a whole?


It's going to be gradually ported into the rest of the game. We reaaaaaaaaaaaaaaally debated this, but we felt it was something that added a drawback that was interesting, harkened back to Original Torg, yet is easy to remember.
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