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Tolerance towards other believers: very low

Posted: Fri Mar 02, 2018 11:00 am
by antema
I've been trying to read the Aventurisches Götterwirken using Bing & Google translators, but it's not really working great. At most I can get kinda reliable info from these short info boxes, and among them "The church of X at a glance" has proven quite informative.

But there are things that I don't quite understand. For the moment the "Tolerance towards other believers" section has been most puzzling. What exactly does it mean in practice? Praios is the king of the Gods, but his church has the lowest tolerance towards other believers. First things first, does other believers mean believers of Twelvegods or believers of gods outside the Twelvegods pantheon? Does low tolerance mean that they do not like cooperating with other Blessed Ones and/or churches at all, or does it mean that they cooperate just fine as long as there aren't any conflicting interests? In which case churches with high tolerance are more likely and willing the reach a compromise and churches with low tolerance will only continue working together as long as the other party is willing to play by their rules?

Thanks!

Re: Tolerance towards other believers: very low

Posted: Fri Mar 02, 2018 12:14 pm
by bluedragon7
It does indeed mean believers of other cults, outside the twelvegods cult. It does include some fringe cults associated with the twelve gods and during the priest emperor reign it also included the cult of Ronda.

Re: Tolerance towards other believers: very low

Posted: Fri Mar 02, 2018 1:52 pm
by antema
Well that's good to know that believers meant believers of other faiths. The German sentence was "Toleranz gegenüber Andersgläubigen" which was translated as "Tolerance towards other believers", but I guess it is actually supposed to mean "Tolerance towards unbelievers" or "Tolerance towards other religions"

Still guessing that "other believers" mean legal & "good" faiths, not evil ones like demons, Nameless or Orc faiths?

Re: Tolerance towards other believers: very low

Posted: Fri Mar 02, 2018 2:39 pm
by bluedragon7
Andersgläubige are „followers of a different faith“ ;)

Re: Tolerance towards other believers: very low

Posted: Fri Mar 02, 2018 5:53 pm
by Bosper
antema wrote:Well that's good to know that believers meant believers of other faiths. The German sentence was "Toleranz gegenüber Andersgläubigen" which was translated as "Tolerance towards other believers", but I guess it is actually supposed to mean "Tolerance towards unbelievers" or "Tolerance towards other religions"

Still guessing that "other believers" mean legal & "good" faiths, not evil ones like demons, Nameless or Orc faiths?

Orc faith would fall under "other beliefs" demons and worshipper of the nameless are clearly cosmologically evil. The orc gods are just other gods. And were and in some places are also worshipped by others than orcs. Orcs themselves arent "evil " creatures. They are just a "barbarical" culture that poses a danger, but they arent more evil than men.

Re: Tolerance towards other believers: very low

Posted: Fri Mar 02, 2018 6:52 pm
by HEX the Dark
I am pretty sure the average citizen of the middle realm will see that quite differently.
The Orcs, and the the Orc gods are evil - for the normal human. They're not evil for the Orcs themselves. But Orcs rape and pillage and enslave (and oppress in the Svelltvalley), so they're not "good" for anyone but themselves.
Likewise the Throwalians are seen as evil in some parts of Aventuria, or are people from Al'Anfa...

Anyway. There is the so called Silem-Horas-Edict that lays down the foundation for "the one, true faith" of the twelvegods. Everything not stated in there falls into the "followers of a different faith" category.
Some manage to sneak around that, claiming to follow a demigod or a saint, but basically that's it.

Re: Tolerance towards other believers: very low

Posted: Fri Mar 02, 2018 7:52 pm
by Bosper
What about the normal human who worships Brazoragh as Ras'Ragh (Thalusia, Ferkina), Ras'ar'Ragh (Fasar), Rashuga (Raschtulswall), Razragh/Razuragh/Razoragh (High north), Razorag (Waskir), Braziraku (old Bosperano) ?

The church of Praios isnt dumb. They wont like the cult of the Orc gods, but they know that they arent demons.

Re: Tolerance towards other believers: very low

Posted: Sat Mar 03, 2018 3:45 am
by bluedragon7
Any incarnation of an Ork god, even if worshipped purely by humans would be an other faith, that is not tolerated. Only the twelve gods and accepted associated half gods ( read up Silem Horas Edict) _in their accepted form of worship_ are tolerated by Praios. That is why witches were sometimes even burnt as they worship Satuaria, who, while being mentioned in the stories about creation, is not part of the group of gods allowed to worship.
The H’Szint faith would also not be tolerated, even though, unbeknownst to most, it is the goddess Hesinde, as she is worshipped by lizardmen.

Re: Tolerance towards other believers: very low

Posted: Sat Mar 03, 2018 5:57 am
by HEX the Dark
Bosper wrote:What about the normal human who worships Brazoragh as Ras'Ragh (Thalusia, Ferkina), Ras'ar'Ragh (Fasar), Rashuga (Raschtulswall), Razragh/Razuragh/Razoragh (High north), Razorag (Waskir), Braziraku (old Bosperano) ?

The church of Praios isnt dumb. They wont like the cult of the Orc gods, but they know that they arent demons.


As bluedragon said, all those people don't worship an Orc god - not to them at least - but their own entity that happens to be a bull and has a similar sounding name (except maybe the folks in Bosparan, they worshipped basiclly everything they could get a hold of).

For all or most of them are the Orcs still "the enemy" and evil. And yes, the Church of praios probably knows that the orcgods aren't demons, but they're not part of the true faith and barbaric idols. I would however not exclude that they refere to them as demon, too.

We have to seperate IG and OT, or character and player knowledge. Of course we as a players know the connection between the different faiths and that the orcs aren't "evil" per se. The aventurian whose house just got burned down doesn't care so much if it was an orc or a soldier of a rivaling country, they're "the evil" for him, and if he is about to be sacrifized to a bullfaced totem then it's very likely that he'll call it a demon, too.

Tolerance towards other believers very low

Posted: Thu Jul 05, 2018 7:59 pm
by BruceMP
your posts are very often very hostile even though they dont need to be. they make discussions unpleasant to read so i at least would appreciate a more buddhist tone