Ethereal qestion

Sarren
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Ethereal qestion

Postby Sarren » Mon Oct 22, 2018 8:57 pm

i was curous if there is specal ammo availble for guns or a perk for those who use other ranged weapons.
It says Ethereal creatures are immune to physical attacks, does this include energy attacks, such as from a flamethrower or electro ray, or do energy weapons effect ethereals normally.

mystic101
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Re: Ethereal qestion

Postby mystic101 » Mon Oct 22, 2018 10:58 pm

Sarren wrote:i was curous if there is specal ammo availble for guns


Orrorsh has ammo for the monster-hunter gun that can hurt ethereal creatures.

Sarren wrote:or a perk for those who use other ranged weapons.


Orrorsh's alchemy perk allows for a variety of different missile weapons to affect ethereals.

Sarren wrote:It says Ethereal creatures are immune to physical attacks, does this include energy attacks, such as from a flamethrower or electro ray, or do energy weapons effect ethereals normally.


I'd say energy weapons are still a form of physical attack, and so wouldn't work. Unless, that is, the attack was caused by a magical, miraculous, or psionic effect, which works on ethereal creatures normally. So a flamethrower or electro-ray, no; but psychic pyrokinesis or a lightning spell, yes.

I'd been thinking about posting a "Storm Knight's Guide to Ghostbusting" for Halloween recently. The above is the basic nitty-gritty, not including any "advanced techniques" or other such hidden gems.

ZorValachan
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Re: Ethereal qestion

Postby ZorValachan » Tue Oct 23, 2018 8:38 pm

I've wondered about the pulp powers myself. Specifically 3 nile characters have electro-ray. Character A has it based off a weird science device, B based on an innate power, and C as a pulp sorcerer's magic, like Rama Tut or mystically imbued like Shazam/Captain Marvel. Does C affect ethereal whereas A does not simply because they have a magical theme? They both bought the same Perk, but does the fluff matter? What about B?

And then what about Ki powers? Based on martial arts, monk mysticism in a realm that can't have full blown miracles.

Good questions that as a GM I'm still struggling with in my own game. I'm leaning towards "yes" if it's a Perk that is powered by magic/psionic/faith, inner strength like Ki/innate pulp power or eternium/eternity slivers like weird science.
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Atama
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Re: Ethereal qestion

Postby Atama » Tue Oct 23, 2018 10:39 pm

To me weird science is semi-mystical so a weird science ray should affect ethereal enemies regardless of “flavor”. Whereas a laser pistol which is pure technology wouldn’t.

That way you keep Pulp powers on equal footing with other supernatural power groups.
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Sunrunner
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Re: Ethereal qestion

Postby Sunrunner » Wed Oct 24, 2018 8:41 am

I would tend to let the pulp power affect it since they are powered by a world law and are not just tech, notice how the Electro ray has no tech axiom. Also fluff wise even the electro ray pistol is notionally powered by an eternium splinter and such. Ultimately its the GMs call, I am a big believer in fluff and someone like Raman Tut the pulp sorcerer who has electro ray should totally be able to affect ghosts with it. I would tend to say that even the mad scientist type who is using weird science still effects it just to keep it simple and like I said weird science is powered by a world law and is really just techno magic. But thats my opinion.

As a side note anyone with faith and the Strike spell can make a weapon magic for 3 rounds to give the party some options to attack ghosts. Overall the few times I have broken ghosts out they have either been very scary because the party had little to no access to magic/faith/psychic attacks and the only option they really had was to run for their lives or they pretty much showed up said "BOOO!!" and then died that round as they ate Strike enhanced attacks and or magic lighting bolts/ bullets or alchemical bombs. Ghost pretty much have Ethereal for defense and that's it. I mean they are like toughness 10 or 11 if they are getting the full +6 darkness bonus and an 8 Dodge and unarmed is not that great, so my players were getting good to outstanding success when they connected and generally were already inflicting wounds before the bonus dice were even rolled.

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TorgHacker
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Re: Ethereal qestion

Postby TorgHacker » Wed Oct 24, 2018 12:55 pm

Sarren wrote:i was curous if there is specal ammo availble for guns or a perk for those who use other ranged weapons.
It says Ethereal creatures are immune to physical attacks, does this include energy attacks, such as from a flamethrower or electro ray, or do energy weapons effect ethereals normally.


Ki powers definitely do not affect ethereal creatures (though we may at some point make a Ki power that as part of the power, does allow that).

Beyond that, it's GM's call, but our recommendation is: If the power comes from a magical trapping, yes. Science, no.
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mystic101
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Re: Ethereal qestion

Postby mystic101 » Wed Oct 24, 2018 1:37 pm

TorgHacker wrote:Ki powers definitely do not affect ethereal creatures (though we may at some point make a Ki power that as part of the power, does allow that).


Before that happens, if it even does, a martial artist can still take the Spirit Bane perk in order to enable all of their martial arts attacks, including all of their normal existing ki powers, to affect ghosts. It's a niche ability to be sure, but it's nice in that it allows even a non-psychic Pan-Pacifican, who otherwise has no native access to any magic or miracles, to still be effective in that area.

Keep in mind that it requires a single add of faith as a prerequisite, but even in super-secular Pan-Pacifica, this could represent a belief in "Confucianism" or "philosophical Taoism", and so could still be in-character, as well as adding to the pc's personality and backstory for roleplay purposes.

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TorgHacker
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Re: Ethereal qestion

Postby TorgHacker » Wed Oct 24, 2018 1:41 pm

mystic101 wrote:
TorgHacker wrote:Ki powers definitely do not affect ethereal creatures (though we may at some point make a Ki power that as part of the power, does allow that).


Before that happens, if it even does, a martial artist can still take the Spirit Bane perk in order to enable all of their martial arts attacks, including all of their normal existing ki powers, to affect ghosts. It's a niche ability to be sure, but it's nice in that it allows even a non-psychic Pan-Pacifican, who otherwise has no native access to any magic or miracles, to still be effective in that area.

Keep in mind that it requires a single add of faith as a prerequisite, but even in super-secular Pan-Pacifica, this could represent a belief in "Confucianism" or "philosophical Taoism", and so could still be in-character, as well as adding to the pc's personality and backstory for roleplay purposes.


Oh right, forgot about that Perk. Don't even need a specific Ki Power one in that case.

But....

I also think personally that Perk is pretty weak for what it costs. I think I'm gonna add a booster to that.
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Atama
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Re: Ethereal qestion

Postby Atama » Wed Oct 24, 2018 8:54 pm

TorgHacker wrote:
mystic101 wrote:
TorgHacker wrote:Ki powers definitely do not affect ethereal creatures (though we may at some point make a Ki power that as part of the power, does allow that).


Before that happens, if it even does, a martial artist can still take the Spirit Bane perk in order to enable all of their martial arts attacks, including all of their normal existing ki powers, to affect ghosts. It's a niche ability to be sure, but it's nice in that it allows even a non-psychic Pan-Pacifican, who otherwise has no native access to any magic or miracles, to still be effective in that area.

Keep in mind that it requires a single add of faith as a prerequisite, but even in super-secular Pan-Pacifica, this could represent a belief in "Confucianism" or "philosophical Taoism", and so could still be in-character, as well as adding to the pc's personality and backstory for roleplay purposes.


Oh right, forgot about that Perk. Don't even need a specific Ki Power one in that case.

But....

I also think personally that Perk is pretty weak for what it costs. I think I'm gonna add a booster to that.

Thanks. I agree. I play a melee character and the Perk is in theme but I’ve yet to run into an ethereal enemy and if I ever do I’d be okay running support while the mage and psionicist take care of it. Investing a perk just so I can hit one specific (rare) class of enemy seems a big waste of XP.

Shadowrun has this problem too. You can be attacked from the astral plane and only certain kinds of attacks and defenses will work against them. So you can invest in abilities that only exist for that purpose or ignore them.

And as a GM you now have the dilemma, if only one or two PCs can participate in a fight against these enemies, why bother introducing them? You then have a fight that some of the players will sit on the sidelines for. But then if those encounters never happen, the PCs that invested in them never get to take advantage of what they spent XP/character points on.

Honestly in general I think that the “immune against normal attacks” thing is not good to include in an RPG. You unnecessarily add some awkwardness into your system that way.

TorgE does have a potential way around this though; you have interaction attacks you can do when weapons won’t work. As long as you don’t do something insane like making ethereal creatures immune to them. In which case you might as well be slapping your players in the face.
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Greymarch2000
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Re: Ethereal qestion

Postby Greymarch2000 » Wed Oct 24, 2018 10:16 pm

But what if they were on a bike? :D


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