Cosm Adaptation

Daedra18
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Re: Cosm Adaptation

Postby Daedra18 » Mon Apr 08, 2019 7:12 pm

pkitty wrote:
TorgHacker wrote:Cosm Adaptation doesn't affect anything with regards to contradictions. So if you're in the reality those Perks are from, it's a 1-case. If you're not, it's a 4-case.


I'm shocked* to hear that. It seems weirdly restrictive to have this perk (Cosm Adaptation) with such high requirements and narrow utility (just one group in one cosm), and then to say that on top of that, you basically can't even get the full benefit of "star" Perks.

If the design philosophy behind Torg Eternity was that acquiring perks from another cosm was a huge deal that should rarely happen, should be the culmination of many adventures, etc., I could see that. But recent ruling are that players can even start with perks from another cosm (they just have to have "I was transformed from that cosm" in their backstory), so it doesn't seem like that's the case.

----

* Not because it's written poorly; I apparently just read it wrong because I assumed it let the player purchase and use the Perk as a native. In other words, the writing is clear, but the effect seems underwhelming.


This is just for Race perks, AFAIK, and not all cosm perks.

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pkitty
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Re: Cosm Adaptation

Postby pkitty » Mon Apr 08, 2019 7:23 pm

Daedra18 wrote:This is just for Race perks, AFAIK, and not all cosm perks.

No, it's for any Perk that the GM feels isn't inappropriate for the new cosm.

Original Ruling: viewtopic.php?f=28&t=3117&p=30056#p30054

FAQ:

Q: Can a character select a Perk if they're not from that cosm?

A: No. They need to be a native of that cosm to select a Perk that specifies a cosm. However, some official archetypes have non-native Perks if the character transformed from their original reality. GM's have the option to allow this for other newly created characters as well.
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Spatula
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Re: Cosm Adaptation

Postby Spatula » Mon Apr 08, 2019 7:32 pm

The racial perks from the transformed archetypes (the flying edeinos being the only one, I think*) are different in that those perks don't cause contradictions.

* the Core Earth stalenger doesn't count as per the clarification in Ruins of the Living Land, which says that perks for unique races aren't particular to the Living Land.

I do feel like having Cosm Adaptation should mean contradictory perks are 1-case for the character outside of the perks' home cosm and not a contradiction at all otherwise. But that's what house rules are for, in case the situation ever crops up.

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pkitty
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Re: Cosm Adaptation

Postby pkitty » Mon Apr 08, 2019 7:48 pm

Right, I mean I'll definitely just house rule it. But I think it's helpful to offer the designers constructive feedback. IMO, "you can use the perk as a native" should be canonical, not something house-ruled. (And if they consider my reasons and still disagree, I am totally cool with that.)
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TorgHacker
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Re: Cosm Adaptation

Postby TorgHacker » Mon Apr 08, 2019 8:37 pm

pkitty wrote:Right, I mean I'll definitely just house rule it. But I think it's helpful to offer the designers constructive feedback. IMO, "you can use the perk as a native" should be canonical, not something house-ruled. (And if they consider my reasons and still disagree, I am totally cool with that.)


This is something Darrell and I already had lots of discussions about. People asked us for an official way to get cross cosm Perks, and there you go.
Deanna Gilbert
Torg Eternity designer
Ulisses North America

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pkitty
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Re: Cosm Adaptation

Postby pkitty » Mon Apr 08, 2019 8:42 pm

TorgHacker wrote:
pkitty wrote:Right, I mean I'll definitely just house rule it. But I think it's helpful to offer the designers constructive feedback. IMO, "you can use the perk as a native" should be canonical, not something house-ruled. (And if they consider my reasons and still disagree, I am totally cool with that.)


This is something Darrell and I already had lots of discussions about. People asked us for an official way to get cross cosm Perks, and there you go.


Then consider me totally cool with that. :)
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TorgHacker
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Re: Cosm Adaptation

Postby TorgHacker » Mon Apr 08, 2019 8:49 pm

pkitty wrote:
Daedra18 wrote:This is just for Race perks, AFAIK, and not all cosm perks.

No, it's for any Perk that the GM feels isn't inappropriate for the new cosm.

Original Ruling: http://www.ulisses-us.com/forum/viewtop ... 056#p30054

FAQ:

Q: Can a character select a Perk if they're not from that cosm?

A: No. They need to be a native of that cosm to select a Perk that specifies a cosm. However, some official archetypes have non-native Perks if the character transformed from their original reality. GM's have the option to allow this for other newly created characters as well.


Note, the GM has the control here. The player can’t just willy nilly pick Perks from any cosm and say they get to keep it because they’re transformed.
Deanna Gilbert
Torg Eternity designer
Ulisses North America

Doomweber
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Re: Cosm Adaptation

Postby Doomweber » Mon Apr 08, 2019 8:57 pm

I of two minds on this one. The first looks back fondly at an OTorg character. Jamaican Realm runner with a spell placed in the official royal Pixaud's Grimoire, an unnervingly high faith, and loads of Star sphere bioware. The second looks back at the same character, look's at the rest of the party, and sees theloss of Cosm uniqueness. One of the aspects of TorgE I appreciate is the power of the cosms. The cosms dominate the laws, you don't get to take your laws with you. Your perks are from your realms. A core earther knight's body fights to preserve its own world. Jamming a bunch of inanimate gear into it (Cyberware) only weakens its hold. While it prohibits the free-flowing no holds barred gotta take em all feel of OTorg, it creates a new importance in the choice of picking your original cosm. Also, it makes Core Earth that much more interesting, with Reality perks being only for them so far. (Tz Ravok possibly gaining them as well). Everyone can house rule, but there is a feel to this new story, and I think these ruling conform to it.

Savioronedge
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Re: Cosm Adaptation

Postby Savioronedge » Mon Apr 08, 2019 11:08 pm

This ruling also preserves something Eternity codified which was just fluff in oTORG...Core Earth is just STRONGER than other cosms. This is why it took 7 cosms to expect a win (4 to make it even attemptable iirc) when there is some insinuating that a few times at least one of the HLs had two invasions going at the same time. And it is why Eternities Core Earthers can take Reality perks.

This perk, if taken by a Core At the earliest opportunity will come with minimal backlash as I pointed out I an earlier post. Non-CE characters not only have to wait longer, it's not as attractive a Perk for them... and, to me, that feels right for this game.

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TorgHacker
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Re: Cosm Adaptation

Postby TorgHacker » Mon Apr 08, 2019 11:14 pm

Savioronedge wrote:This ruling also preserves something Eternity codified which was just fluff in oTORG...Core Earth is just STRONGER than other cosms. This is why it took 7 cosms to expect a win (4 to make it even attemptable iirc) when there is some insinuating that a few times at least one of the HLs had two invasions going at the same time. And it is why Eternities Core Earthers can take Reality perks.

This perk, if taken by a Core At the earliest opportunity will come with minimal backlash as I pointed out I an earlier post. Non-CE characters not only have to wait longer, it's not as attractive a Perk for them... and, to me, that feels right for this game.


Basically the intent.

Essentially what this is doing is establishing that "Yes, you CAN have cross cosm Perks. It's just hard."

And then the GM can house rule that to their heart's content.
Deanna Gilbert
Torg Eternity designer
Ulisses North America


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