Hot Targets for High Lords

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Wotan
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Hot Targets for High Lords

Postby Wotan » Mon Feb 19, 2018 6:24 pm

What do High Lords love? Possibility energy. How do they gather it from their Cosms? The big answer, so far, seems to be population centres.

With that in mind I've been looking at global population maps, to look for targets which the HLs might well be eyeing hungrily, and for regions which neighbouring HLs might compete, or even come into conflict, over.

I thought the following map's worth sharing with other GMs who care to look at such things:
http://luminocity3d.org/WorldPopDen/#4/45.09/22.06

Obviously, capturing population isn't likely to be the only strategic objective of the HLs, and we have unknowns in terms of the relative PE costs of extending an existing Cosm area with Stelae, as opposed to dropping new bridges and establishing new Cosm areas.

However, from looking at the map, the following thoughts occurred to me:

Orrosh & Pan-Pacifica: Well played! they must be absolutely raking the PE in compared to the other invaders! One big question for the future is which of them is going to get to Indonesia first?

Aysle: Is Uthorian drunk? Insane? (even by HL standards) I know he likes his "Vikings" but Scandinavia seems to offer a really poor return on investment in terms of harvesting PE from population. There are some high population areas to spread into in NW Europe, but he's going to be competing with Malraux & Kranod, and if too successful could end up stuck between them & fighting a war on both fronts.

Nile Empire: The same question could be asked of Mobius, but we know he's insane. Still, he's also a genius, so what's he up to? I can't help but feel that his southern push is probably about taking historic sites, or the creation of faux historic sites, along the Nile, as his Axiom wash hits. Maybe he's going to head west towards the population centres around Nigeria, but why not drop a new bridge there? For that matter, if he was purely after population, heading up the Levant coast, into the middle east, would have been more profitable.

Cyberpapacy & Tharkold: They both look like they're likely to be competing with each other and Uthorian over Western Europe. Malraux's almost certainly going to be primarily focused on Rome, if he feels he can take it. He also has the option to spread into North Western Africa, and there are some Catholic population centres on South America's eastern coast which might be tempting.
In terms of population density, Kranod's most tempting invasion target looks to be heading west into Europe. Given his relationship with the Russian Govt, he has a lot of potential to spread east easily, but it's low risk low reward stuff. Heading down into the middle east either via Eastern Europe, or through the Caucasus, is likely to be more effort, but might also yield some worthwhile targets which Mobius might otherwise get. Tharkoldu are lazy though, so this might be too much effort.

Living Land: He might look like a big dumb lizard, but he's actually played things pretty well. Though it took several bridges to achieve, he's nibbled off, or at least contained, most of the significant population centres in North America. What's left of the USA, is not only largely isolated from the rest of CE, it's also an unattractive target for other HLs to drop a bridge into. Leaving him the opportunity to expand outwards, & time to consolidate & join his Cosm fragments up at his leisure.
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Re: Hot Targets for High Lords

Postby Gargoyle » Mon Feb 19, 2018 9:24 pm

Yes, love these types of discussions. muhahahaaha.... ahem. Yes. well. <composes self>

Wotan wrote:What do High Lords love? Possibility energy. How do they gather it from their Cosms? The big answer, so far, seems to be population centres.

With that in mind I've been looking at global population maps, to look for targets which the HLs might well be eyeing hungrily, and for regions which neighbouring HLs might compete, or even come into conflict, over.

I thought the following map's worth sharing with other GMs who care to look at such things:
http://luminocity3d.org/WorldPopDen/#4/45.09/22.06

Obviously, capturing population isn't likely to be the only strategic objective of the HLs, and we have unknowns in terms of the relative PE costs of extending an existing Cosm area with Stelae, as opposed to dropping new bridges and establishing new Cosm areas.

However, from looking at the map, the following thoughts occurred to me:

Orrosh & Pan-Pacifica: Well played! they must be absolutely raking the PE in compared to the other invaders! One big question for the future is which of them is going to get to Indonesia first?

Agreed. Vietnam/Laos/Thailand/Cambodia scares me more though as I can see a fairly terrifying mixed zone coming.

The Gaunt Man in particular chose a location with plenty of people and potential Eternity Shards, with relatively close access to Europe and Asia, but also relative isolation because of the terrain and wilderness between population centers. And rumor has it he has something going on in the Philippines, perhaps a quieter more insidious invasion.

Kanawa is likely to stab someone in the back in a big way, it's just in his (her) nature. No telling who, except certainly not the Gaunt Man. I think he's likely to go after whoever is the least capable of responding in kind, and as an opportunist.

Aysle: Is Uthorian drunk? Insane? (even by HL standards) I know he likes his "Vikings" but Scandinavia seems to offer a really poor return on investment in terms of harvesting PE from population. There are some high population areas to spread into in NW Europe, but he's going to be competing with Malraux & Kranod, and if too successful could end up stuck between them & fighting a war on both fronts.


Can only guess that there are Eternity Shards/Ley Lines/MagicalMacGuffins galore to make up for the lack of population. Or more likely he's there because he thinks it might be his only chance to avoid the prophecy of his defeat.

Nile Empire: The same question could be asked of Mobius, but we know he's insane. Still, he's also a genius, so what's he up to? I can't help but feel that his southern push is probably about taking historic sites, or the creation of faux historic sites, along the Nile, as his Axiom wash hits. Maybe he's going to head west towards the population centres around Nigeria, but why not drop a new bridge there? For that matter, if he was purely after population, heading up the Levant coast, into the middle east, would have been more profitable.


The pseudo-Egyptian ruins that have no historical record of existing in the Egypts of either Core Earth or Terra that are popping up were something Mobius didn't expect, so I think that he's crazy and the most inexperienced High Lord can account for his presence in Africa. But as you say, he's also canny and we know his northern offensive is a mere distraction and his real goal is something to the south in the Lake Victoria area.

Cyberpapacy & Tharkold: They both look like they're likely to be competing with each other and Uthorian over Western Europe. Malraux's almost certainly going to be primarily focused on Rome, if he feels he can take it. He also has the option to spread into North Western Africa, and there are some Catholic population centres on South America's eastern coast which might be tempting.
In terms of population density, Kranod's most tempting invasion target looks to be heading west into Europe. Given his relationship with the Russian Govt, he has a lot of potential to spread east easily, but it's low risk low reward stuff. Heading down into the middle east either via Eastern Europe, or through the Caucasus, is likely to be more effort, but might also yield some worthwhile targets which Mobius might otherwise get. Tharkoldu are lazy though, so this might be too much effort.


Malraux is clearly playing a defensive game; he's more about securing potentially faithful and playing defensive than any sort of expansion. He has the smallest realm and the most backup stelae. This is probably smart given how many invaders there are. His motivations are a little different than other High Lords too, he's more about his religious pursuits than becoming Torg. I think we'll see him pop up in other traditional Catholic populations to expand though and repeat the same methods...I think a tight realm in Brazil/Argentina for him would be good. Also Malraux has to be terrified of the Living Land. A goddess walking a land granting miracles more powerful than his? Nothing more complex than a spear works? I don't think he'd invade too close to its borders early on. He also hates it and is probably looking to do whatever he can to get others to weaken it for him. He also has to be concerned about the proximity of Aysle and Tharkold, as they are also nightmares for his realm. Malraux is likely paranoid as hell and hoping some of these realms take each other out while he turtles, and that's not a bad strategy.

Kranod is in a bit of trouble and needs a win. I think he needs to be daring and take something populous and some distance from his existing territory, something with a decent population that would mesh readily with his reality. He may not have the guts to do it, but Jezrael would, and I think Kranod's Darkness Device would agree, and let her kill him. Then after taking over she might just drop a bridge into Las Vegas and press on into Los Angeles and down through San Diego and into Mexico. What's left of the USA would probably stop them just shy of Phoenix. Maybe. Baruk Kaah would be enraged and probably cause problems for him, but I could see it being a bloody stalemate. And then the Tharkoldu would likely resume their laziness and just enjoy Vegas, LA, San Diego, and Tijuana for a while.

Living Land: He might look like a big dumb lizard, but he's actually played things pretty well. Though it took several bridges to achieve, he's nibbled off, or at least contained, most of the significant population centres in North America. What's left of the USA, is not only largely isolated from the rest of CE, it's also an unattractive target for other HLs to drop a bridge into. Leaving him the opportunity to expand outwards, & time to consolidate & join his Cosm fragments up at his leisure.


Meta thinking, but I reckon since Baruk Kaah was such a disappointing villain in the oTorg canon, he won't be this time around. I think he's going to do just as you say leaving a tiny sliver of the USA left to Core Earth, perhaps just Texas. After that, I think it will depend greatly on how the other High Lords progress. Central and South America might look pretty ripe for the taking, I think I see him going overland for the entire invasion, perhaps even using miracles to create new land bridges to eventually invade Europe and/or Asia. I'd say that might be a while, but if he's stalled in South America, it may be sooner than one might think.

Of course, those pesky Storm Knights might have something to say about all this. This time around I think they will have a significant impact on the map.
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Re: Hot Targets for High Lords

Postby Spatula » Mon Feb 19, 2018 11:28 pm

Huh, Egypt and most of the rest of Africa is pretty damn empty. It does seem like, if population density was the primary goal, some juicy targets were passed over.

Personally I don't get the attraction of sticking the Tharkoldu in the southwestern US. You can make a horrific dystopia out of Los Angeles or Las Vegas, but it's hard to do without it turning silly or pathetic. Because the parts of those cultures that everyone knows are, in fact, rather silly and pathetic (I say this as a 20 year resident of the area). The differences between the movies Escape from New York and Escape from LA somewhat illustrates the point, I think. Aside from that, it's just a too bright and smiley and wide open of a place for giant demons and grubby resistance fighters and undead horrors to be running around in, IMO. I feel like they belong in someplace dark & gloomy, or maybe just war-torn.

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Re: Hot Targets for High Lords

Postby Gargoyle » Tue Feb 20, 2018 7:51 am

Spatula wrote:Huh, Egypt and most of the rest of Africa is pretty damn empty. It does seem like, if population density was the primary goal, some juicy targets were passed over.

Personally I don't get the attraction of sticking the Tharkoldu in the southwestern US. You can make a horrific dystopia out of Los Angeles or Las Vegas, but it's hard to do without it turning silly or pathetic. Because the parts of those cultures that everyone knows are, in fact, rather silly and pathetic (I say this as a 20 year resident of the area). The differences between the movies Escape from New York and Escape from LA somewhat illustrates the point, I think. Aside from that, it's just a too bright and smiley and wide open of a place for giant demons and grubby resistance fighters and undead horrors to be running around in, IMO. I feel like they belong in someplace dark & gloomy, or maybe just war-torn.


I can't think of a better place. Ideas?
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Re: Hot Targets for High Lords

Postby TorgHacker » Tue Feb 20, 2018 8:43 am

*cough*

InvasionPlanClip.png
InvasionPlanClip.png (2.09 KiB) Viewed 1389 times


Unlike the Cylons, they really do have a plan. :lol:
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Re: Hot Targets for High Lords

Postby Gargoyle » Tue Feb 20, 2018 9:19 am

TorgHacker wrote:*cough*

InvasionPlanClip.png

Unlike the Cylons, they really do have a plan. :lol:


Any chance we will get some hints to what the other High Lords are up to at the Year One point when the LL sourcebook comes out?
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Re: Hot Targets for High Lords

Postby TorgHacker » Tue Feb 20, 2018 12:53 pm

[[REDACTED BY ORDER OF THE DELPHI COUNCIL]]
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Re: Hot Targets for High Lords

Postby Spatula » Tue Feb 20, 2018 1:05 pm

Gargoyle wrote:I can't think of a better place. Ideas?

I think where they are now is pretty good. Russia, Eastern Europe, they can push west into central Europe or south into the Middle East... (looks at Day 90 map) Hey wait, were all those Tharkold Stela Sites to the south, east, and west that are not linked to zones on the map before? I don't remember seeing those. And if they were, why aren't they filled with Tharkold zones?

If they were going to drop into North America, I would maybe pick Canada around one of the big cities, like Toronto. Or Mexico, especially in places where the cartels have a lot of power. The jungles of Central and South America, where they can hunt their favorite sport among the trees (Predator!).

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Re: Hot Targets for High Lords

Postby Gargoyle » Tue Feb 20, 2018 1:16 pm

Spatula wrote:
Gargoyle wrote:I can't think of a better place. Ideas?

I think where they are now is pretty good. Russia, Eastern Europe, they can push west into central Europe or south into the Middle East... (looks at Day 90 map) Hey wait, were all those Tharkold Stela Sites to the south, east, and west that are not linked to zones on the map before? I don't remember seeing those. And if they were, why aren't they filled with Tharkold zones?

If they were going to drop into North America, I would maybe pick Canada around one of the big cities, like Toronto. Or Mexico, especially in places where the cartels have a lot of power. The jungles of Central and South America, where they can hunt their favorite sport among the trees (Predator!).


I just noticed those too, they were not there last time I looked. Invasion plans, or perhaps they were there before the bomb and just aren't active again yet? @TorgHacker !!!!???
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Re: Hot Targets for High Lords

Postby fougerec » Tue Feb 20, 2018 1:24 pm

Spatula wrote:
Gargoyle wrote:I can't think of a better place. Ideas?

I think where they are now is pretty good. Russia, Eastern Europe, they can push west into central Europe or south into the Middle East... (looks at Day 90 map) Hey wait, were all those Tharkold Stela Sites to the south, east, and west that are not linked to zones on the map before? I don't remember seeing those. And if they were, why aren't they filled with Tharkold zones?


That is a lot of unattached Tharkhold stelae...


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